Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: Biggest problem right now we have in our industry out here are the billboard attorneys. No question about it. They're the ones who make up all these facts, make up all these rules. Some of them are paying people to sign up with them, which is ridiculous. Every time I see an attorney on tv, they're lying about something, all of them. They sell the name to people. So it's not the same thing.
[00:00:39] Speaker B: Most firms survive. The best ones scale.
Welcome to the Managing Partners Podcast, where law firm leaders learn to think bigger. I'm Kevin. Daisy. Let's jump in.
What's up, my people?
Welcome to another episode of the Managing Partners Podcast.
Happy to be here today. It's a hot beginning of summer day here in Virginia, where I live, and I have my friend Mason on the show here, and he's across the other side of the country, right side, right outside of la. I know me and Mason have known each other for a little while now because we're in a kind of a peer group mastermind, if you will, that meets weekly.
It's kind of an open, come as you go can kind of group. But it's been very helpful, I know, to me and Mason as well. So, Mason, welcome to the show and please introduce yourself.
[00:01:33] Speaker A: Thank you for having me, Kevin. I'm Mason Rosh Dion. I am a personal injury attorney. I first started as a defense attorney about 28 years ago. 29 years ago. And after the first nine years, I switched hats from the defense side and now I do planners work. For the past 20 years, I've had my own office in the Santa Clita Valencia area, which, if people know where Magic Mountain is, I can see Magic Mountain from my.
From my window.
So I do primarily personal injury cases.
I've live out here for 20 plus years. Two kids. Both are adults now, which is shocking to me because you just blink and all of a sudden your kids are adult age.
[00:02:13] Speaker B: Yeah, my.
My son will be getting his driver's permit this year, which is crazy. So.
[00:02:19] Speaker A: Oh, boy, I remember those days.
[00:02:21] Speaker B: So how did you do all this? And you're still in your 30s. That seems like a. I wish I
[00:02:26] Speaker A: was in my 30s. Yeah, that was about 30s, 20 years ago.
[00:02:32] Speaker B: Well, Mason is happy to have you on the show, and thank you so much. Mason's just a nice guy and is always asking questions and sharing as well when we're in the group. He also, he started a podcast, and I was one of the first, I think, on his podcast.
And I appreciate you having me on. Yeah. Just come on today to just kind of chop it up and talk business. I love the transition from criminal to personal injury or just making that switch at all to whatever practice theory it is. We just had a client come on board with us that as soon as they signed on, they're. They're going from family law to criminal law.
So it's just okay. You know, sometimes people have a different change.
[00:03:13] Speaker A: Yeah. Yeah. Actually, I didn't do criminal. Ironic love in. In. When I went to law school, I did work for the DA's office out here and I wanted to work for the DA's office when I got out as a deputy district attorney. But it is so hard getting into the District Attorney's office out in Los Angeles and that hiring freeze at the time. So what I did was I actually did defense work on the civil side. So it was, it was the insurance defense work. So I would defend lawsuits filed by plaintiffs, which is the opposite side of where I am right now. So I'd be defending individuals and construction companies and landlords and people who got in, who got sued in car accidents or slip and falls or whatever it would be. So what I do, except on the other side, that's what I did. Which taught me a lot at the time.
[00:03:57] Speaker B: And my apologies. I thought you said some defense. But defense side, that makes sense.
Let's talk about what's new in your business and what's kind of on your radar right now as far as initiatives within the business. Marketing. AI is obviously mentioned every second of the day, right?
Networking, referrals. Like what. What's kind of your, your thing right now.
[00:04:20] Speaker A: So just talking about what's going on in our business in the, you know, Southern California area. You're right. AI is a big issue. Right. Everyone's trying to implement it, and if you're not, you're falling behind. That's the reality of it. But you're also very consistent of how much you're going to use it. So if you start using to prepare court documents, you're going to get in trouble because there's still those phantom cases that AI comes up with that are not legitimate. So there have been at least two or three attorneys out here who've been sanctions for just using AI. And all you have to do is, look, have AI help you as a tool, but don't have it prepare everything, right?
Make sure if you're citing something, go see if the case actually exists. Make sure the case is actually citing what AI is claiming. And judges are mindful of that. Judges don't mind using AI to help you with things. But just don't have it write things for you like that. That's not what we're supposed to be doing. So that's one issue. The other issue is now Lyft and Uber are having really huge lawsuits out here against the billboard attorneys. And I can see why. Biggest problem right now we have in our industry out here are the billboard attorneys. No question about it. They're the ones who make up all these facts, make up all these rules. Some of them are paying people to sign up with them, which is ridiculous. Completely be unethical. Every time I see an attorney on tv, they're lying about something.
All of them, even the ones who've been around for, claim to be around for 50 years, like Jacoby Myers. They're claiming their advertising says, oh, we've been helping plaintiffs for 50 years. That's not true, because Jacoby Myers, that existed 50 years ago, is not the same firm that's using Jacoby Myers now. They sell the name to people, so it's not the same firm. So everyone out here. And that's becoming really frustrating, as at plaintiff's attorney, because it is so hard trying to be ethical, trying to do what's right. And you get all these people who just not just basically doing whatever they want. And the state bar is not really holding me accountable.
[00:06:26] Speaker B: There's Uber, Scott.
They've got tons of money that they're going up against, you know, lobbying and all kinds of different things that they're doing. I follow Bob Simon with the Simon Group, and, you know, he's pretty vocal about that. So I think they've raised like 60 million or something like that to.
To fight against Uber on some things, which Uber is going to bring a lot more money than that to the table.
[00:06:52] Speaker A: So, yeah, just look, just do, do what's right. Be a ethical plaintiff, you know, a plaintiff's attorney. Just help your clients what they need. Don't make stuff up, plain and simple. Don't lie to people, don't lie to your clients, don't make up false lawsuits. Just be an ethical guy. It's not that hard to do. That's the issue.
Right?
[00:07:15] Speaker B: Be a good person, be a good lawyer, be a good law firm.
[00:07:19] Speaker A: Exactly.
[00:07:19] Speaker B: Easy peasy. Come on, people.
[00:07:20] Speaker A: Exactly. Yeah. And I know we talk about marketing, so we do everything we can. Like, you know, like I said, you, you mentioned we were a mastermind together. You're my podcast, which is called the SCV Long Life Podcast. So I started that to make connections with people, and it's been good. It's been interesting. I mostly have attorneys and people who are in the financial segment on my, on my show.
[00:07:41] Speaker B: Yeah, I think a lot of, a lot of folks just want to do like, you know, talk about the law or maybe talk about car accidents or talk about, you know, gun charges or whatever their, their niche is. But, you know, using it to build roof rules. Other attorneys, financial planners, doctors, you know, chiropractors, people that could be referring you cases, create a show that gives them a platform to, to talk about what they do. There's use for it in a lot of different ways. And I've been podcasting now for, I don't know, five or six years. It's been the best thing. I just get to get on here and talk, right. Have a conversation and just see where it goes. And it's just been invaluable for me. So considering if anyone's listening out there, especially if you want to create content, social content, articles you can give to your SEO team, you know, your PR team, it's, you know, unlimited amounts of content.
[00:08:34] Speaker A: Now that stuff being said, like I said, almost everyone that I've used has been an attorney or in the financial arena, stuff like that, except for one. I, I had one podcast which was just for me because I wanted to have a guest on that was totally different than anything I do.
[00:08:51] Speaker B: And you can do that. It's your podcast.
[00:08:52] Speaker A: Yeah, exactly. So you remember Will, who was, who was with Armando's group. He was my coach. Yeah, he's no longer with Armando.
[00:08:59] Speaker B: Will Brooks, right?
[00:09:00] Speaker A: Yes. Yeah, so he was my coach. So one day, you know, we're doing our coaching thing and he says to me, if you could pick anybody you want on your podcast, who would it be? And I said, there's no way I want to be able to get who I want because it'd be totally different than what I do.
So, so I mentioned mufon, which is mutual UFO network, especially with Disclosure Day coming out with Steven Spielberg's movie. And he goes, I'm just gonna email him, see if I can get somebody for you. I go, there's no way. And I got the director of marketing from them who has his own documentary that is on Netflix. So that was it just kind of for me. Cause that's, I like that genre, you know, talking about it.
So it was an hour long podcast. I, you know, it was, it was different. It was definitely different than what I usually do.
[00:09:47] Speaker B: Well, yeah, you don't. There's no rules, you know, and you can, you can kind of have anybody you want on the show. I've had a ton of non lawyers on my show, but we talk about stuff in relation to run a law firm. You know, whether it's business or, you know, I've had Mike Michalowicz, who's the author of Profit first and many other books you can kind of get have fun with it. It doesn't have to necessarily be your client or your lawyer or whatever. You can also just go on by yourself and maybe you have something to share and you don't have a guest at all.
[00:10:17] Speaker A: So yeah, I don't know if everyone wants to hear me talk.
It's usually my guest. That's just it. I mean I like having people like you who knows business, who knows what they're talking about, that's, you know, give knowledge to people who are looking for it. That's what you, what you want to have.
[00:10:31] Speaker B: And I'll say I know a lot about business, but the truth of it is it's my business partner, the one that implements and brings all that to the table. I got my COO and business partner who you know, is the ones literally in the, in the day to day grind to implement and figure these things out. I'm more on like the relationships, business development, sales, which is an important component. But I listen and I pay attention to everything we implement and I know what works, what doesn't work, this podcast that you know, have guests like you and 500 plus others that I'm just soaking stuff up all the time. So whether or not I've done it exactly that way or whatever, I can share a lot because I'm always just listening to soaking up. I would be the worst at just going and trying to do it all myself. So you have to surround yourself with people and bring in other people to help you get that done.
[00:11:23] Speaker A: Right? Yeah. And I can tell you even to get stuff hat on, whether the content creators, whether they're attorneys who work in other arenas that I don't work with, I actually learn a lot from them. I've had two or three estate planning attorneys who have taught me stuff which I did not know. I don't do estate planning, but it's great to learn from them. And when I get referrals from a client who says I need somebody who does estate planning, I know exactly who to send them to because I've talked to these people, I know exactly what they do and I trust them.
[00:11:52] Speaker B: So yeah, yeah, well, you know, when someone has to hire an attorney, it's usually not for a good reason or it's something that they've never had to do before. Right. So they're, they're exploring this market for the first time, asking questions, searching, asking people, friends, family, going on Google, AI, whatever it is they're not experienced and what to, to say or ask or whatever. So when they usually get an attorney, even if it's a plaintiff's car accident, attorney, whatever, that's the only attorney that they might know. So when they have a.
Another issue or they want to take care of their estate or will or trust, they're probably going to come back to the source. And you want to be that connector, you want to have that Rolodex of attorneys that you trust, say, hey, we don't do that, but I have a person that can. It's good to have that built up for sure.
[00:12:44] Speaker A: You know, I'm trying not to have the label of an ambulance changer because once in a while you still hear that. I mean, we handle all sorts of cases obviously all throughout California. In my almost 30 years of experience, we've handled everything and anything there is from all the way from Sacramento all the way down to San Diego. Your typical car accidents. Yes. Slip and falls, burn injuries, dog bite cases, nursing home incidents, elder abuse cases you come up with. I handle a case with a wild snake at one point, which was nobody's pet, and he still attacked somebody. And let me tell you, stay away from those rattlesnakes. Especially the younger they are, the. The worse.
[00:13:21] Speaker B: The worse. Yeah, they have more venom, I think. Right.
[00:13:25] Speaker A: They don't know how to control it. Exactly.
[00:13:27] Speaker B: Heard that before.
So in a case like that, what's the outcome? Is that them suing the state or the city or.
[00:13:36] Speaker A: Well, that was, that was just the weirdest case. One of the weird cases that I've had. It wasn't. It was basically three houses next to each other or three lots. The one on the very far left, somebody was. It was an empty lot. People wanted to move stuff around to start building on it. And once they started moving trash bins around, the snake goes into the middle house.
[00:14:00] Speaker B: Right.
And so they disturbed and disturbed the property that was sitting there vacant.
[00:14:05] Speaker A: Right. So. So the guy in the middle house, there's a snake. At first, the people from the land that the snake went from, you know, they send their kids to go knock on the guy's door. The guy was postal worker, so knock on guy's door to tell him, hey, there's a rattlesnake in the backyard. But he opens the door, thinks there's salespeople closes the door on him. Bam. But at some point, he finds out there was a rattlesnake in the backyard, and he grabs a shotgun to go kill the snake. And he had been drinking, right?
So then the wife calls the neighbors on the other side, the one who, there's a house on the right hand side, and says, hey, there's a rattlesnake here. I need your help because my husband's got a shotgun, blah, blah, blah. So then my client lived in the back house of that neighbor. And so the neighbor calls him, who used to be a volunteer firefighter, to go help out with the snake. So grab a can of CO2, go to the guy's house to try to, you know, prevent it from accidentally shooting somebody, and then the story changes from there. There's different versions of what happened. One version was my client says, you know, we sprayed the CO2 on the snake, and the snake was cold. I went to go grab it, and the homeowner came by and used a rake and just hit the snake. The snake jumped up a bit me. That was our allegation. So, yeah, he, you know, by the time paramedics got to that soon, dad. To enforce him into, you know, coma, to save it, you know, because his brain was swelling up.
So he spent two weeks in the hospital. So that's what. That's what it was. That was one of the unusual cases. Yeah, I've had a cemetery case where somebody's body was moved without permission of the family and stuff like that. I've had Starbuck cases that Mason's had.
You name it. Like I said, you name it. We've handled it.
[00:15:57] Speaker B: So you should niche into rattlesnakes.
You can have a show on Discovery Channel.
[00:16:05] Speaker A: You know, one thing I'm going to do. I've been talking about this forever. One day I'm going to write a book. It's going to be a coffee table book of not the cases we've handled, but the cases we haven't taken, because those are even crazier than some of the cases we do handle.
[00:16:21] Speaker B: Well, it's good. You got to turn down cases. You can't take everything, right? So.
And I think, you know, as I see firms grow and get bigger and more, they just get more niche. And they.
They seem to.
To turn away more cases and figure out what. What's not a fit for them.
[00:16:36] Speaker A: But we're talking about, like, yeah, we're talking about, like, crazy cases. Like, this guy one time called our. Called my firm, and he said I was in the Back of electronics store. Big buy, right? Best Buy. I'm sorry, Best Buy. And I was going through, through their garbage pail.
I was positioning myself on top of the trash bins so I could grab stuff out of it. I lost my balance. I fell down and ran into a pole. That was his claim. I go, what did they do wrong? He go through their garbage? His thing was, it's an attractive nuisance. They shouldn't have stuff in their garbage pill if they don't want people to come get it.
[00:17:16] Speaker B: So it's like, yeah, that's like you were basically robbed, like illegally earned trespassing, I would assume at, at that point too.
[00:17:25] Speaker A: There's a whole lot of stuff with it, but it's like, no, thank you.
But that's kind of stuff we're talking about. Yeah.
[00:17:31] Speaker B: Hey, this is a pro tip for everyone out there. If you go by Best Buy, they have a bunch of free electronics out in their trash.
Don't try to steal it.
[00:17:38] Speaker A: No, don't try to steal it. Absolutely not. That's the tip of the day.
[00:17:41] Speaker B: You know, what is, what is the next step with your firm future? What's your next goal as far as, you know, are you kind of niching down and tightening down into an area or are you kind of going more broad? You know, are you looking to expand on the team at all?
What, what's that look like for you?
[00:18:00] Speaker A: So I've been a solo guy ever since I opened. I do have my assistant who's been with you for 11 years now, and she knows more about the law than a lot of the attorneys trust me, that I deal with. But no, I think our goal is just to help people from here on until, you know, it's time to retire. There was a point when I first opened my firm and I wanted to be the biggest firm out here. But you know what? I want to be able to go home and enjoy time with my wife and my kids and my dogs. I don't want to be that guy who has to be here from 6 o' clock in the morning till 8 o' clock at night, works 80 hours a week.
Because once you get too big, especially you get too big too fast, then you cannot give the service that you want to your clients. Plain and simple.
[00:18:42] Speaker B: There's no wrong answer. You know, some people want to be huge and not even be a lawyer and just be a CEO and hire everyone to do everything else. But, but you get. Once you kind of grow, though, you gotta, you gotta keep going. You can't have three people and sit around. You can't have 10 people and do nothing.
[00:18:59] Speaker A: Correct.
[00:19:00] Speaker B: You have to really, you know, you gotta keep on rolling. So, you know, there's pros and cons, I think, to both, both sides. But some people want to grow, some people want the lifestyle business, and that's totally fine. And there's plenty of solos that listen to the show that are in that same spot. They want to be more efficient, they want to have more time, but not necessarily just grow and scale.
[00:19:23] Speaker A: So, yeah, I mean, slowly is good, but if you go too fast, it's a disaster for any, by the way, that works in any business. It's not just what we do. Pasta market, they started opening up stores everywhere and they went out. You cannot grow too, too big, too fast, because then you cannot control what you're doing. You lose service, you lose stuff that make you. You help you get there in the first place, so.
[00:19:48] Speaker B: Well, yeah, the same thing too, you know, on the marketing side is, you know, your brand is unique, so whether or not you're solo or you have a hundred attorneys, it doesn't matter. But staying true to what that brand is. And if that's service and direct with Mason, if that's your thing, then you leverage that to its fullest.
If it's, hey, we have a hundred lawyers, so you'll always be taken care of, whatever that message is.
Like, Morgan and Morgan is, we're the largest firm in the world. Right. So that does what they do. So you take one or the other. You know, some people like that, some people won't.
[00:20:25] Speaker A: Yeah, but there's a reason Morgan and Morgan's rating is so awful. They had like a 2, 3 on Google. It was so bad, they literally took their Google website page down because it was that bad. And we're not talking about just like getting a couple of hundred reviews. They had like over 3000 reviews by then. You know where you stand. We have a 2.3 out of 5 with over 10,000 reviews. Yeah, it's. It's not good.
[00:20:49] Speaker B: Any big company is, you know, at some point when there's such a size that it's going to be hard to do. And, you know, they scale so big and have so many attorneys, it's trying to harder control quality across that.
[00:21:03] Speaker A: Yeah, so I, I did a video once comparing us to Morgan and Morgan. Morgan, Morgan's like McDonald's. It's the factory base, in and out, same exact thing, formula for every case they have. We're like spago. You come to us, we tailor everything to you which you want based on your case and your individual circumstances, plain and simple.
[00:21:23] Speaker B: And it's. That's your advantage over. Over the bigger guys. So I have firms a lot. We can't compete. We can't compete. Yeah, you can. You just. You're different, and you have to lean into that.
[00:21:31] Speaker A: And.
[00:21:31] Speaker B: And some people are going to love to have connected with Mason. You're going to be talking to them and work their case.
Um, there's gonna be folks that call them Morgan and Morgans and, you know, for whatever. Whatever appeals to them, but they weren't a good fit for you, probably, anyway. Well, Mason, I appreciate you coming on to share. I appreciate you having me on your podcast.
[00:21:50] Speaker A: Thank you so much.
[00:21:50] Speaker B: And, yeah, you're just out there chugging away.
You relate with a lot of folks, I'm sure, that listen to the show.
You got your podcast up and running. That's awesome. Everyone's always like, that's. That's hard. I need setup and equipment and time.
Would you agree that it's that hard, or you think it's pretty simple now?
[00:22:12] Speaker A: You know, the hardest part is just getting started.
That's it.
Because all you really need is just a microphone. This. And once you figure out what platform you use, it's just getting in front of the camera and getting comfortable. That's about it. And I'll be honest with you, before I did the podcasts, I used to have somebody come and take videos for me for social media, and I hated it. I hated being in front of a camera. But one thing that the podcasts have done is make me a little more comfortable or a lot more comfortable in front of a camera, which is. Which is important.
[00:22:44] Speaker B: So, yeah, you can just sit right here in front of your own setup and make your own video.
[00:22:48] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:22:48] Speaker B: And not feel so like someone's there. Whatever. When someone gets a camera and they set it up and then they're like, okay, we're recording for some reason. Yeah. That just changes your whole. Like. Like. Oh, and people freeze up.
[00:23:03] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:23:04] Speaker B: So, yeah, this. This is super easy for anyone that wants to. Yeah.
So to do themselves.
[00:23:11] Speaker A: Are you a sports fan out there?
[00:23:13] Speaker B: I'm a semi sports fan. I'm Commanders, which used to be the Redskins. I was an Orioles fan growing up, but I don't really watch baseball that much. I've been trying to watch some of the soccer. I'm a Formula one fan, so I do watch Formula One.
[00:23:29] Speaker A: Okay. Thank you.
You know, as you can see, I'm a Laker fan and a Dodger fan, and My football team are actually the Cubs game.
[00:23:38] Speaker B: I'm going to a Cubs game next week. I'm going to a Cubs game next week in Chicago.
[00:23:43] Speaker A: Who are they playing?
[00:23:44] Speaker B: They're playing the Padres.
[00:23:46] Speaker A: Okay, well, for that case, go Cubs.
Never been to Wrigley Field, but I like to one day. I like to see Wrigley Field.
[00:23:55] Speaker B: I've been there once and they replayed the Padres.
I just happened to be there in May, I think 2023, and went to see the game with a bunch of lawyers actually, and they lost pretty badly to the Padres.
But we had a box with food and drinks and, you know, didn't really care because I'm not a fan of either one of them, so.
But I was a Cubs fan that day and I'll be a Cubs fan next week, but we'll see what happens.
[00:24:24] Speaker A: That sounds good for me.
[00:24:26] Speaker B: It's like sports. I, Sports are any sport. Live is, is awesome.
[00:24:30] Speaker A: Yeah. Yeah. Do you think Daniels is going to come back healthy, your quarterback?
[00:24:34] Speaker B: I hope so, but I don't know. We, we keep, we always get these like awesome, like crazy quarterbacks like RG3, and then they, they get hurt and like the first season they're out. So.
Yeah.
[00:24:47] Speaker A: Yeah. Well, always hard. I mean, yeah, I, I, I knew RG3 wasn't going to really survive after a few years. It's too hard for you when you have a running quarterback. You need to have a shotgun quarterback more than anything else.
[00:24:59] Speaker B: And the running quarterbacks seem to be, tend to be lanky and, and they're just, they look like they're, they can break in half compared to the, the, the other guys on the field. So.
Yeah, we'll see. I don't know. Good luck to us.
[00:25:14] Speaker A: You'll be fine.
[00:25:16] Speaker B: As long as we just beat the Cowboys and the Eagles.
[00:25:19] Speaker A: Hell yeah. Absolutely. I'm not a Cowboy. It's like anybody who plays the Cowboys, I root for, for that team.
So, you know, hope I didn't lose
[00:25:27] Speaker B: any listeners of the show, but, you
[00:25:29] Speaker A: know, sorry Cowboys fans, but hey, I'm a Raider, so you guys can say anything. All my Raiders. I told you. I agree with you. I'm not gonna.
[00:25:39] Speaker B: Well, that's, that's what I've been about the Redskins since I was like born is. We had a couple good years, but you can't say much.
[00:25:48] Speaker A: But when our fourth coach on our fourth coach and a fourth quarterback in four years. So there's that.
[00:25:56] Speaker B: All right. Well, I appreciate you coming on the show and chopping it up with me and yeah, check Mason out, y'. All. What's the best way for folks to find you? Check out your website.
[00:26:06] Speaker A: Website is M R S C V L A W dot com. That's my.
My firm website and I'm putting together. I actually have one. Masonroshdian.com. and that'll get you through all my social media. That's like a tree that'll have all my social media information on it.
[00:26:24] Speaker B: So nice. Yeah. Mason's just a nice guy. Fun guy. He's real. So go follow him, check him out, and we'll see you on the next episode. Everyone, thank you so much for listening.
[00:26:35] Speaker A: Thank you, Kevin.
[00:26:36] Speaker B: And we'll see you soon.
[00:26:38] Speaker A: Okay, thank you.
[00:26:40] Speaker B: Bye, everyone.
Sam.
