Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: Foreign.
[00:00:18] Speaker B: Most firms survive. The best ones scale.
Welcome to the Managing Partners podcast, where law firm leaders learn to think bigger.
I'm Kevin. Daisy.
Let's jump in.
All right, what's up, everyone?
You got Tommy on the show from out of Louisiana. Tommy, I got a question for you.
My new startup lawyers out there that just went out started their own firm that might be listening. What's a good tip you'd have for them?
[00:00:53] Speaker A: Somebody just going out on their own and starting. I guess my piece of advice would be just learn to say no. And I say that with the context of, you know, when you're fresh out, if you're going fresh out of law school and trying to go rogue and hang out your own shingle, or if you're leaving another firm, you know, you're going to want clients because you're going to need income and you're going to want to build your reputation, your practice. And so your inclination is probably going to be, look, I need to take anything that comes in the door. And so I kind of fell into that trap myself when I came out of law school trying to do, you know, one of the first kind of claims I got was a divorce. And so through elimination and some. Some efforts, I kind of realized, like, this isn't what I want to do. You know, the, the expenditures and the amount of time and just the fee structure wasn't something I was comfortable with. So. And still to this day, you know, once you. You find your niche, and so that would kind of piggyback into the say no, say no to the things that you're not interested in, and don't just chase clients to get checks, but you probably want to focus on what you practice areas are going to be. So for me, I kind of narrowed it down to PI and, and criminal defense, but I'll dabble in a few other things. But the more established you get and the more clients you get and the longer you practice, you'll probably get random phone calls for all kinds of stuff. And so you just need to be comfortable to, to kind of nip things in the bud and maybe kind of tell people, hey, before we set up a meeting or before you go into this long winded explanation, what exactly is your issue? Because if it's something that I can't help you with, I want to kind of set that boundary first off. But b, I want to know what the issue is, because now I could possibly refer you to somebody else who, who I know, you know, maybe a friend from law school, maybe somebody you've met through a podcast or just, you know, any kind of group. And so I think that's just the best piece of advice I could give is just learn to say no and, and don't take on things that you'll end up, you know, harming your career over.
[00:02:39] Speaker B: Not good advice. That's, that's, I think when we start out, you know, it's, it's. You want to say yes and you want to take on things and, you know, you're excited just to be able to pay some bills and get going. So. But, but it's a trap you can fall into and get stuck in. And, and yeah, good advice there. So. Well, Tommy, I want you to, you know, introduce yourself, obviously, tell us a little bit more about your, your background, your story and how you became to be on your own and running your own firm down there in Louisiana.
[00:03:05] Speaker A: So small background. Tommy Botto. I am from a small town called Cut off the Louisiana.
It's not even technically a town. I think if you Google it, it's. It Wikipedia, say it's a census designated place. I have no idea what that means, but essentially it makes up. It's in Lafourche Parish. It makes up an area called salafourche. It's like five, six small CDPs that feed into one high school. It's called Salafourche. So I went there, graduated, went to undergrad at University of Louisiana, which is located in Lafayette.
And then from there applied to law school in Loyola, moved to New Orleans, I believe took a year off after I graduated, went to New Orleans in 2007, went through my first year of law school, didn't really know if it's I. What I wanted to do once I got there, so had some issues with that. Kind of thought I was going to quit. I took another year off and then went back. Started throughout law school, finished that. And upon graduating, job market was, you know, pretty terrible. I didn't clerk or anything. I worked my way through, through law school, so I didn't have any jobs coming out, did the whole interview process, went through a couple PI firms and thought that was going to be the route I went. And then finally couldn't get a job because there was no experience on my end. So it was kind of a catch 22. You can't get a job, you don't have experience. Can't get experience if you don't have a job. So I said, you know what? Screw it. I bartended all through college, all through law school. I said, I'll keep bartending and just try to hang my own shingle out. And that kind of led me into taking anything and everything that came in the door. Did some contract negotiations, utilized my notary stamp till no end, just being a notary. But then I got a call from a couple friends of mine who were in a car wreck. They had hired this big law firm out of New Orleans and weren't happy with it really early on, I think after the first month. And so got my first car wreck case. And so it just happened to be a couple. So it was two and a half. And that's kind of how we got from there. Started out on my own. 2015 was when I opened my office.
Did it for two years, was. Was trending correctly. You know, it was going up and really enjoying it. And what happened is I found out that I had recently got married, so in 2016, and then found out my wife was pregnant in 2017. And so what initially happened is one of my mentors that who kind of did similar career paths was working. He was working with another lawyer. They had like a quote unquote partnership. And he went out on his own and another prominent lawyer in the area asked him to go be an associate. He said, look, it's probably not the right time for me, but I got a guy for you. So I went interview there and realized, you know, maybe being on my own and supporting a family wasn't the way to go with no benefits, no insurance, stuff like that. So kind of tucked my tail between my legs and went be an associate for a couple years and, you know, learn some things, things that helped me out of my practice, learn a lot of things I didn't want to do in my practice and how to handle things in. In cases and intakes and so essentially winded down, you know, my own solo. And in the midst of doing that, it kind of realized, wow, you know, maybe I was doing a little bit better than I expected. I don't know why I did that. But stayed there for four years, all through Covid, and then finally in 2021, just went back out on my own. And so, you know, we Law office San Giovanno has been since May. It's in May, it's going to be four years, back out on my own, but kind of predominantly a solo lawyer throughout my journey.
[00:06:22] Speaker B: Interesting path, you know what I mean?
Which is cool. I mean, you know, everyone's got a different story and it's. But I think it's. It was probably wise, you know, you're on your own from the Beginning, you know what I mean? So you didn't really see like how people do things, processes and all those things. So to go back and get some experience and then, and then have the realization that, okay, I need, I need to do my own thing again. That, that's. I don't think I've heard that path before, which is, yeah, it's, it's pretty cool.
[00:06:48] Speaker A: It's the road less traveled, you know. So usually it's, it's. People get a job right out of law school at the big firms or they go work at the defense firm. That's kind of the roadmap in, in our area, in, in personal injury. Either go work for the big TV firms, which, down here, you know, there's, there's a few big players and they've got 60, 80, 90 lawyers, whatever it may be. So you go there, you sit at your cubicle, you bring business in and you realize, why am I making somebody else money? Or the other cliche thing, and I always find this funny is the guys that say, oh, I did defense work for years and then I ul. Ultimately felt bad for playing. No, you didn't. Like, you just, you saw what you were doing, you realized you were on, you know, you were, you were the black hat and, and taken up for corporate greed. And then you wanted to go make some money on your own. So it's just with me, I always knew I wanted to be on my own. I always knew, like, I wanted my name on a building and, and so now that I'm doing it, you know, maybe I don't want my name on a huge building downtown. That's, that's not my career path. But obviously, you know, I wanted to at least say, hey, I gave it, I gave it an attempt. I'll work for myself. I, I really don't want to work for anybody else. I just think my style doesn't. Tends not to play well with others, as you'll probably see on some of my, my social media things. I like to be different. I like to do things a different way. And so I, yeah, you know, my professional attire is not what, what most people would consider professional, but this is me. And that's kind of how I prevent my, you know, present myself.
[00:08:03] Speaker B: And I love it. And that's why, you know, that's why you're on the show and kind of talking to you here. And yeah, everyone, if you're listening or if you're watching, yeah, go check out some of his stuff. I mean, it's totally different than what you'll see out there. Website, color schemes for his brand. You know, how he dresses and carries himself big in the sneakers, but he's got his own style, his own brand. He's being himself. And I think, you know, that's. These days for me, that's the best lawyers out there have that different brand. They stand out, they're doing something different. But it's, it's, it's not made up. It's. It's just who they are. Like, I met Kevin Kennedy. I don't know if you know him. He's the dude with, like, all the rings. He's on TikTok, and he's.
[00:08:41] Speaker A: He's just like. Yeah, I think. Is that the guy with, like, the throne and he wears the. The Better Call Saul style suits, all the pastels and all?
[00:08:48] Speaker B: Yeah. And he's. I think it's. He's from Tennessee. But if you meet the guy, he is that guy through and through. You know what I mean? He's not just trying to be like, that's just him. And so, you know, but that, that works. And he's, you know, so I just like the different style. And how you go against the norm best out there is pretty cool. Um, the other thing cool about with Tommy is, you know, kind of like my friend Lloyd, he knows Lloyd down there, bourgeois, you know, really between some big markets and in a smaller town, but with big, huge firms that spend lots of money in and around his market. So how does a startup firm compete? Right. How do you stand out? How do you get clients? I think that's what a lot of, you know, startup firms that I talk to all the time. That's. That's our biggest concern. And a lot of them are sold or told.
Yeah, you, you, you can't. So good luck. But I've seen plenty of them do it.
It's, it's. It can work and you can do it. Tommy, tell me, you know, what has worked for you as far as, you know, since you started backup or like, even like today, right now. Like, you know, you. I know you do some different tactics and guerrilla marketing, and some of your social is just different. Tell us a little bit about some of those things and what's worked well for you.
[00:09:59] Speaker A: Yeah, so primarily, and this isn't to sound cookie cutter or whatever, this, you know, might be the most cliche answer, but you, you have to do good work for your clients, you know, above a number one. You know, getting them through the door is one thing, but them keeping you and, and, you know, the, The Biggest thing as, as a small lawyer or solo lawyer is you gotta get referrals. Referrals and word of mouth are your lifeline. Because if, for instance, if those first two clients that were my friends, you know, one of them is still probably my, a number one referral source to this day. You know, he owns a business, he's got a lot of employees. When his employees get in wrecks, he's still referring me cases today. So it's a good trade off. You know, he also has a heavy foot, so when he gets the speeding tickets, I'll go help him out for him. And you know, it's, it's a, it's a great world, but that's, you gotta do good work because you want those clients to keep referring you to other people because you don't have that war chest. You're not spending six figures a month to compete with these big dogs on tv and you don't have all the billboards and you're not died, you know, not dotting Highway 90, going from here to Alabama like some of the big players in New Orleans and all that. So you want to do good work first and foremost. Now secondly, what you, what you try, what you want to try to do is there's ways to advertise that don't, and don't involve the traditional media, you know, not radio, not tv, not billboards. But you could find a way to stand out in your own way and that, that could trend from just helping out. And so for instance, if you have recreational sporting leagues, things like that, whether you want to volunteer your time as a coach, an easy way to do it is to sponsor these things. So for me, a big, a big thing is I sponsor any, any sports team from back home that, that reaches out to me. Chances are I'm going to do something, whether it's my name on the back of a jersey, whether I'm hanging signs in, in their gymnasiums, you know, and that goes for local high schools that, you know, I got my banners in. Both schools I grew up in, they know to call me and, and my big thing is, you know, I know there's a lot of lawyers and there's a lot of local lawyers who do a lot of different things. But for me, I try to just, it's not being, I don't think, mean or conceived. It's just like, hey, if you're going to call me to do something, you know, how many other lawyers are doing this? And b, am I the only personal injury one? Because, you know, I like to stay in my lane. And I like to say, hey, if I'm going to be helping you out with this, you know, it's. It's tit for tat, but just helping out in your community. And so whether it's local sporting things, whether it's. Another big thing I like to do is I help out fishing, rodeos, they got a bunch of different charities that throw. Throw those down in Grand Isle or, Or other areas of Salafourche and. And lower Louisiana. Just find a way to make yourself present in other ways that these big lawyers aren't. So while they're busy sponsoring the New Orleans Saints or the Pelicans and have their ad in the Superdome, you know, I'm okay with having my. My banner in a local high school gymnasium. So just in. Just in case somebody's at that game and. And knows somebody who got in a car wreck or God forbid they get in a car wreck on the way home, somebody might have saw my sign there and might just look up. Oh, you know, well, instead of calling these lawyers who sponsor the Saints, who have no idea who I am, let me call Tommy, who's gonna, you know, meet with me personally and handle my case. And so that's the other thing is you want to make sure that you are doing things these big firms aren't. So they're gonna spend the money they wanna be first of mine and. And the first one that people remember. But on the other hand, if. If you are gonna compete in this market, you have to differentiate yourself. So for me, how I try to do it is I say, look, you know, one of my little slogans is, I'm putting personal service back into personal injury. And so the big thing is, I am a solo office. And even if I do get an associate or two down the line, I'm not just going to turn myself into a businessman. I'm going to have my hands on the files. I'm going to be the face of the business. I have no problem still. And it's going to be a decade now. I'm doing this in May. I have no problems making house calls. So for the people who can't make their way up to, you know, right outside New Orleans, because that's where I'm located. My headquarters are in Metairie. But for people who live one, two, three hours away, I'm gonna. I have no problem going meet them somewhere. You know, whether it's a coffee shop, whether it's in their home. If they're that badly injured, God forbid, I Have to go to the hospital. You know, obviously I don't like making those trips because that's, that's not good. You know, if I gotta meet up with somebody in a hospital. So, you know, we get those shticks for the ambulance chases and all that, but if somebody contacts me, hey, you know, my aunt got hurt really bad. You know, my mom's in the hospital, she got rear ended. Do you mind? You know, we've already had people contact us. We don't feel comfortable. What do we do? I have no problem still doing that, you know, and I don't, I don't foresee a time where I won't be doing that unless I'm just really older and you know, not having the ability to do that. So make yourself accessible, find different avenues to put yourself out there and just, you know, focus on, on what you bring. Everybody's going to bring something to the table. That's a lot different. And so for me it's just, I have a good understanding of a personal injury just because of my own experience, but just knowing and like you said, guerrilla marketing. So you know, I have a couple choice billboards and I'm just selective about where they're at. Like I think I might tell you that when we talk the towns you're from. And yeah, literally, it's, there's so happens to be a billboard in my parents. It's not in my parents yard but it's literally on their street. And so when I got the bright idea, I'm like, for a while it was, hey, you know, what are you doing? You know, people don't, didn't really know that I was a lawyer or they would see it at a basketball game or something or they'd open up the program like, oh, I didn't know Tommy was a lawyer. And so for the first six or seven years it hasn't, it hasn't been as bad lately. But I just got tired of. I'm like, man, like, you should know what I do by now. Like, I'm in your face. It's, it's everywhere. I'm my kid, you know, my name's under your kid's basketball jersey. How do you not put two and two together? So I said, here's my idea. I'm going to get a billboard. I'll go against the grain, you know, my crusade on billboard lawyers. But that way when people pass my parents house where, you know, they probably came when we were little, that's what Tommy's doing, you know, let me call him and so just be, be choice, be selective about what you do, but just try to be more present and find what works for you and how it could market yourself better.
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[00:16:39] Speaker B: That's my last name.
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[00:16:48] Speaker B: Those are interesting, you know, really cool, good tips. And I was telling me and Tommy when we chatted before, it's kind of like your power list. Grant Cardone. There's other people that talk about a power list, but like your power, you know, your referral group, so your friends, your family invest your power list. It's like the folks you know very well personally and that can expand out to, can be hundreds of people. But how many of them actually know what you do? Right. Um, have you called them all, talked to them all? And you'd be surprised that most think maybe have an idea, whatever, but you'd be surprised on how many people don't. So what if just your power base, I think it's called power power base actually knew what you did? Every single one of them. And then they know their own hundred plus power base. And so just starting with making sure your folks, your friends know what you do and what Tommy's done is, you know, hey, this is my hometown where everyone knows me. Bam. Let's make sure that they know what I do. And they know you. They, you know, they want to look out for you, they want to refer you if they can. So I think the other great thing is, yeah, the big firms aren't going to be sponsoring local high school sports and things like that. So that's an opportunity. Right. And the other thing you talked about is agility. So you're small, you're agile, you get to work with them directly. You can go to their house, you can go meet with them somewhere else. The big firms aren't going to do that. So you got to find ways to be different, to stand out. And even if you do grow and scale, you can scale those things that you're talking about if that's what you choose to do. So that's what makes Tommy different than the big guys. And so, you know, when you're starting out, you got to find those ways that, you know, you can slip in and fit where you can and be different. And, and then you'll start to build a practice. So good tips. Love it. And so you yourself too, you were in a car accident, a car wreck. He likes the better.
[00:18:31] Speaker A: Hey, I like that you've learned, you've learned a little. Yeah, I look and that's, that's why I hate the term car accident. And you know, I've said it and it's because there are, there are no accidents. Every car wreck, there's some underlying issue that, that caused it. Whether it's the person on their phone texting that rear ends you, whether it's somebody not paying attention to a light. And even if you want to go further that if it's truly an accident that a tire or a wheel flies off, well, chances are somebody's liable for that. Whether it's the repair shop who changed the tire, is it a manufacturer that didn't install the part properly. There's always going to be an instance or, you know, another factor that contributes to the wreck. There are no, just true accidents. And so that's why I hate the term because people use it and it downplays everything, you know, like people will say fenderman or this and that, but, you know, and, and that's going to probably go into a stereotype issue. But there's literal medical documentation and, and studies that show at nine miles an hour, you could suffer a herniated disc if the impact is, is correct or, or prop, you know, so I just hate when people just, you know, oh, you're just ambulance chaser. You're just looking for car accidents and this and that. People are always quick to say, oh, I'm sorry and feel bad for the other person that hit them and they don't think about themselves. And so that's why I always try to disassociate that. So to me, there's only car wrecks. And so, yeah, to answer your question, yes, so I do have personal experience with, with the Car wreck of my own back in teen. We were leaving. I was bartending there in Essence Fest, a big event and we were coming back home, me and my friend of mine, he was a security guard, he was driving. We were heading back home. Want to say probably five or six in the morning, you know, obviously New Orleans, we, we work late heading back home. It's probably about 10 minutes away from our house on the interstate and we got rear ended. A guy was doing 103 and so he hits us wearing a SUV. We slept over multiple times. Had my seat belt on. Somehow, some way, I got ejected from the vehicle, out the back glass. They think car rolled over me somehow. I'm like face first in the dirt by a tree. I don't really remember anything. I remember parts of it. I was on the phone with my now wife when this happened. So she's kind of like freaking out. I don't kind of know where I'm at. I'm talking to her. My head's like all split open. If you look really good in some of my pictures, it's still got a nasty scar. It's my Harry Potter scar as people call it. But essentially I'm still kind of talking to her, telling her it's no big deal, get rushed to the hospital. Long story short, I broke my neck, broke my arm, had bruised lungs and you know, gashes and stuff all over my face. So I had like, I think it was eight staples in my head and like 27 stitches all around. So still, you know, got the beauty marks to prove it. But going through that, obviously it was my first car wreck that I could recall that I was, that I was hurt in and so had to spend a couple two days in the hospital and then I didn't need surgery or anything, so I was lucky that way. But walked around with a neck brace. It was supposed to originally be for four to six weeks, but it wasn't healing right. I ended up having to leave it like for 10. So that was pretty miserable. But it was just, it rendered me kind of useless. Like I had to move back in with my parents. They, they put me a recliner in the middle of their living room because couldn't lay down, so I had to sleep sitting up. My only saving grace obviously, besides, you know, my mother taking care of me. My fiance who was coming back on the weekends just to kind of take care of me was Grand Theft Auto came out that, that time period. So that saved me because it was. I was still on my PS4 playing Grand Theft Auto, but yeah. So learn from that. And during that process, my mother in law is actually a paralegal. She's been an office, well she's an office manager now, but she's been a paralegal for 25 plus years. So she kind of helped me navigate my own claim and was like, look, you know, usually we would get you to my boss or something like that, but it's a, you know, it was a slam dunk claim. There was no commercial policy. It was, it was all minimal. We had to stat. In Louisiana we have like the lowest premiums I think in the nation's 15,000 limits. So it was essentially two $15,000 policies. We had to, you know, I had and I tell people all the time and it's unfortunate, but at a worst case, quarter of a million dollar injury with $30,000 in insurance coverage. So learn lessons about that firsthand the hard way. She helped me do the claim and then kind of in handling that and talk, you know, because I did talk to my own adjusters after the, the months of the wreck and got everything kind of settled not to pay any fees. That was great. But in doing that, you know, she kind of showed me the ropes and she was like, look, you know, you really have a good personality for this. Like, I don't know. All I wanted to do is a criminal lawyer. I guess I left that out. My background, like coming up, I knew I wanted to be a lawyer. I thought I was going to go high. I always wanted to be like high profile criminal lawyer, like blue collar, I guess the stuff you might see on suits or things like that. Better Call Saul was a. But I was like, you know, I want to represent somebody in the Mafia. Like that was my big goal. Like, you know, be the guy on the news, like, hey, my client's not guilty. No comment. Next, you know, are we. Travesty of justice. He's going to be set free. But so she was telling me like, hey, you know, you should really do this. And I just kind of blew it off. I'm like, yeah, okay, whatever, Ms. Darlene, that's fine. But when follow around a criminal lawyer after I passed the bar and all that and realize, hey, this is, this is not what I want to do. You know, chasing around a check and going to all these arraignments and a lot of times you're dealing with people's families because they're locked up and then they can't afford to pay you. And it's just, it never seemed to jive at what I wanted. It Was it was going to be a long path to get to where I want it to be. And I was like, this might not be it. And so when the car wreck thing, those two car wreck clients signed up with me, yeah, it kind of brought back some, you know, it was easy for me to relate because obviously while their injuries weren't as severe as mine, you know, I was like, well, look, if I can handle mine, and I know how I felt, you know, how I felt in that hospital bed handling your, your usual run of the mill soft tissue claim is going to be piece of cake or for somebody who needs a knee surgery or things like that, I'm well equipped to handle it all. And so, you know, doing that, I kind of went back to my mother in law and said, hey, you know, maybe I do want to do this. Like, can you, can you give me some, can you give me some pointers? And you know, and any lawyer could tell you this, the most seasoned one, I mean, your paralegals are your lifelines. They, they essentially allow, I run the day to day and the business stuff. But you know, my paralegal now, Monique, she's great. She's kind of similar to my mother in law. Like, they're just old school paralegals. They've been practicing, you know, they've been in the law longer than I've been a lawyer. So you know, I turn to them a lot and hey, what, what did you think here? Hey, ever had something come up and you know, a good lawyer will admit his paralegal is, is his lifeline. So, you know, my mother in law helped me greatly and now I still kind of reach out to every once in a while, like, hey, you know, it could be something simple. Hey, you got a form for this? Do you, do you recall like ever having this kind of issue? And they'll just, they go from memory, so.
[00:24:38] Speaker B: That's awesome.
[00:24:39] Speaker A: Yeah, that's, that's kind of how I got into this world is, is my own personal and, and that's why I think it, it helps me, you know, and I'm not saying I'm leaps and bounds better than anybody else, but if, if I combine what we were talking about earlier, my personal handling of somebody's file, you know, I, I make that a point. Like when you, when you sign up with us, you're not a number. I mean, God, for, I don't even have enough, I haven't even had clients enough to start putting, you know, I remember everybody by name. Yeah, sure, they'll have a reference number in our online system. But when you're calling, you say injury. I mean, you know, my paralegal will give me a keyword and I'll know, okay, yeah, that's this person with the herniation on the cervical herniation she's treating here and yada, yada. So the personal service combined with my own personal experience, I just think makes me more than equipped. And that's kind of what my, my marketing is kind of based on is. Look, you'll get bombarded with all the lawyers saying all the same things. And there's actually a study right now because Louisiana, it's huge issue for the last couple of years, tort reform. I think Georgia just underwent something like that. That was on a couple of podcasts that I've been, I've been looking at. But it's front and center. They just started legislation. They're going after billboard lawyers. And somebody ran a study. I think it was like an hour of local television, like on the News. There were 19 lawyer ads, sometimes back to back to back to back. So of course I'm going to take that. And because it's true, I mean, they're all the same. It's the Power five. It's all the big firms with the fancy billboards, the high rises, the 90 lawyers. They all say the same stuff, you know, and every once in a while, they'll go after each other. Like, I'll call him. He's not even from here, or, oh, you can't, you know, but some of them, and they'll straight up admit, like, we don't practice law, we're businesses. But they're. They're number one. They're recognized. Like, when people think car wreck, they think them. So what I try to do is like, look, don't call them just because, you know them, just because they got that fancy number in their catchy jingle, call somebody you know is going to help you. And in my, you know, not only, you know, is personally going to help you, But I've been there. You know, I could promise you that maybe somebody in their law firm's gotten a wreck and knows what it's like to be in a car wreck. But have they been in a hospital bed? Have they broken their neck? Have they dealt with realizing that, you know, their injury was worth more than the policies. I've been there, so I've been on both sides of the coin. I've been injured. I've been through the trials. Like, I've had. I've seen people, thankfully myself, you know, we haven't lost the trial. So I've seen the triumphs, but I've seen people get taken advantage of. I've seen how the process works. And that's what I just think, you know, it makes me equipped to, to represent my clients better.
[00:26:59] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, totally agree. And with that experience you have. But, but yeah, with Tommy's marketing too, you know, if you're looking at social media, I think it's great, you know, going after the big firms, go right at em, use it against them, and that's the advantage you have. So back to like, anyone that's listening, that's trying to start their own firm, especially in PI, especially in a big market, you can do it. Is it going to be easy? No. Is it going to be overnight? No.
[00:27:21] Speaker A: No.
[00:27:22] Speaker B: But you have advantages that the big firms don't have and you gotta leverage this.
[00:27:28] Speaker A: And it's just. I'm still getting comfortable. You know, the first time I made a video, it was weird. And it's still kind of weird having to do it because. And that's, I guess it's, it's both plus and minuses on that because the big firms, you know, they have their marketing agencies, they've got their people coming. And the place I worked before, you know, he, he was one of the guys who advertise and he still kind of does, but it's. You get swallowed. You could get swallowed up in it. Like, so every once in a while you always make a joke. Like, you'll see the power players are there and they're there no matter what, they're always going to be there. But every once in a while you'll see a new guy pop in and you're like, oh, he settled a big case. Now he's trying to compete with these guys. So it's never going to mesh. You're never going to get to that point. You know, I don't have an ad agency telling me what to do. I don't have a marketing. It's all me. And so, you know, do I think I'm the best thing since sliced bread? No. But I, I want to do stuff different. And so I know that if I would try to go and hire one of these companies, they'd be like, well, we can't do that. Or that doesn't make any sense. Or your ideas are too crazy. Like you can't afford to do the ideas you want. So with me doing my own stuff and doing guerrilla marketing like it, it gives me a unique point of view because I could go there and you know, say things and toe the line. So I've always told people like, hey, you want a commercial? And I tell people this all the time. Yeah, I would love to have maybe one or two commercials, but it would probably be my last couple because I would, I would strike a chord. I'd strike a nerve. And, and they'd probably say like, you can't do this, you know, because. Louisiana. Yeah, Louisiana. Lawyer advertising, so highly regulated, you got to get it approved by the bar association. So chances are, when they would do it, you know, people would see it and probably be like, no, you can't do that. And I'd poke the wrong bear and probably get a cease and desist. So I'm waiting for those days because to me, everybody's like, aren't you scared? Like, you post this or you say this? I'm like, no, because I was like, if these guys know who I am, then, then I'm good. So it's, it's, you know, I'll keep doing what I'm doing.
[00:29:11] Speaker B: I like it.
[00:29:12] Speaker A: Yeah, that's, that's kind of where. But yeah, it, it's tough. It's, it's not going to come easy. You just got to, you got to find what works, you know. So am I going to get up and do a dance on TikTok? No. I know there are some lawyers who do that. Am I going to do every little trend that I see on Instagram? Probably not, but there's bits and pieces and stuff. So you could do it in different ways. And one thing that I have learned though is don't be cookie cutter because that's what made me start actually doing my videos is I've been seeing kind of the people trying to do it. And, and a lot of times what you'll see now is it goes back to like, we're talking about sneakers and the way I dress. Every once in a while I'll go to like the functions with our associations. And you'll see these, these old dogs, you know, call them the dinosaurs. They've been advertising forever and they've always been one way. But now you'll see these guys. All of a sudden they're not in suits and ties, they're in sports coats and jeans. And I've, you know, I saw one 80 year old guy rocking Jordans the other day. I'm like, what are we doing here? Okay, for me to do that, like, even now I go to professional function, I'm like, man, am I toeing the line. Like, I show up to a deposition every once in a while and I'm, I'm in a polo and Jordan's and you know, defense counsel is looking at me like, what are you? I'm like, well, this is me. I've told my clients this is how I'm going to dress. I'm making them feel comfortable. That's cool. But you see people trying to play parts that they aren't. So don't, you know, don't keep saying the same. Oh well, hire me because I've got 30 years experience of experience and we've had over $5 million combined. Well, great. But you've been practicing 65 years. I would hope you had $5 million recovered. Like let's, let's focus on something different. So all that to say this people like content from lawyers. That isn't lawyer not legal related. So just, you know.
[00:30:45] Speaker B: Agreed.
[00:30:45] Speaker A: But don't, you know, now the pizza review thing, that's overused. Everybody wants to do a pizza review and find something else. Eat a cheeseburger maybe. Like that's just my, that's my thing is try to find something different you could do that'll keep people interested that it's not always monotony. Hey, three things to do in a car wreck. This is what, you know, switch it up a little bit. And that's kind of, that would be my advice for starting small and just trying to, you know, because that's what it is. It's almost like a popularity contest. And it's not a game what we do, it's people's lives. But you have to get clients. And so you just have to make people at least know who you are. And they're either going to, they're going to love you, they're going to hate you, they're going to laugh at you, you know, but somebody who laughs at you think you're stupid if they at least remember you, you're doing something.
[00:31:24] Speaker B: Yeah, no one's going to like you. Not one's a perfect fit. Neither one should be a client.
You just gotta keep doing your thing and be yourself. And the people that are connected to you or drawn to you, they'll, they'll come your way. So yeah, 100 I think, you know, there's a lot of like Jefferson Fisher, he's down in Texas. He's got like 6 million followers or something like that. He doesn't talk about the law at all. He just talks about communication with people. And so yeah, they just know he's a lawyer through looking him up, but he doesn't talk about the law at all. But he's got a massive following so you know, that's worked well for him. So just like you, if you're known in your community, people know who you are just being yourself and that's going to, you know, draw clients to you. So, yeah, good information, definitely. Interesting background and path. All of this super cool. And I think, you know, that's the thing about this podcast and, and you know, bringing on people to have different stories. They've done things differently, they're doing things differently like you are and people can just pick up some ideas of their own. So if they're starting their own firm or if you're listening and you have a firm that you've had for many years, I know lots of older lawyers right now that I'm talking to that used to be doing very well and now they're, they're not. And so they're trying to get back to where they were. Things change, online marketing changes. Competitors are moving in to almost every market. So you gotta, you gotta do things differently.
[00:32:42] Speaker A: Yeah, good lessons. I mean, you know, but the bar, I mean, and I know there's key areas all over the country, you know, so I know, I don't know how the lawyer population does it there, but here, especially New Orleans area, it's oversaturated. I mean, I'll call it like it is. There's too many of us. So it's a dog eat dog world. And then not only that, so the competition is, is, but it's a transition now, especially now just the practice of law itself. So now you got AI and I laugh, but I mean, every once in a while we get these articles of people getting popped for writing. They're citing cases that don't exist. So it's, and it, what happens is, it's kind of what you're saying. It's these, these older guys who have been practicing and don't know technology and they're trying to, to incorporate this stuff and not using it right, and thinking that they could just say, hey, write me a memo for this appeal. And they're going to court and they're getting destroyed and judges like this case doesn't exist. So it's, it's, it's just, it's constantly evolving. It's the practice of law. And especially now it's people trying to stay afloat with people who used to compete with these, with these high marketing, you know, firms and not doing it anymore. So they're just hemorrhaging money. But then also on Our side of prac, you know, you can't. And that's. That's kind of what I'm said in a video the other day. It's. That's great. You. You have 85 years of combined experience. Well, we're not driving Model Ts anymore. Car wreck, you know, car wreck in 2025. I mean, it isn't even. It's not even the same since 2015. Since I started, the. The medical treatment has changed, the billing has changed, the amount of hoops that insurance companies are making. When I started practicing, it would be your medicals would reach a certain point. You get a referred for an mri, and boom, We' limits. Then a couple years down the road, it's okay, well, now you got to get that mri. Then it became, oh, well, we see the mri, but he's just old. How do we know he's really, you know, so then you have to go to a spine. Like, it's just. They keep moving the goalpost. And so, you know, the limits used to be a lot lower back then. I don't know how people survive, but there used to be 10, now they're 15. I'm hoping we move them again. So it's. It's just constantly evolving, and you have to learn how to. To evolve to this space, not only in the practice, but also in the marketing aspect. And, you know, as of right now. And that's why I love social media. It's unregulated, and I mean that, like, you don't have to get everything passed by. And I think it's because the people who regulate that don't know. It's the Wild west, essentially, you know, and so that's why I like it, though, because that's where your clients are. Your clients aren't watching the TV that they were back in the day. So me growing up, yes, all we had, you know, we weren't in New Orleans, but our. Our local news stations were the New Orleans one. So, you know, you had channel 4, 6, and 8, and all you were seeing was Morris Bart ads or, you know, whoever else was. And so now he's still there because obviously he's the head honcho. He's the first one who did it down here. And of course, all the politicians hate him. That's who they're. And it's. Right now, it's great. I'm on Twitter and Mars Bart's fighting with all the senators and the representatives about Billboard lawyers. But, you know, he's always going to be there. He's he's top of the totem pole. But it's just, it's a matter of, well, kids like me aren't watching local news anymore. They're on their phone, they're on TikTok. I mean, you know, I'm 40. I'm, I'm on Instagram, but now, you know, I never used to want to be on. And I swore it off, but I was like, okay, if I'm watching this dude make an Instagram video for his law firm, like, this is not, you know, I could do something at least more entertaining than that. And so that's what kind of got me started. So, yeah, you have to shift your base. And, and, you know, one of the best stories I ever had is obviously, besides sneakers and stuff like that, is I'm a huge. I'm a video gamer. Me and my wife both are. I actually signed up a client who I had never met ever in my life face to face. He was, we used to play Call of Duty together, and he knew I was a lawyer from our, from our group chats and got in a wreck. And he was six hours away, but still in Louisiana. He said, dude, aren't you, aren't you an ambulance chaser? I was like, I, I, I'm a personal injury lawyer. Yes. He goes, dude, I just got in a wreck. Like, I don't know what to do this. I said, are you serious? He goes, yeah. I said, how about you take my email down and we'll. And sign him up literally the next day? Never. You know, I mean, that, that's, and that's the beauty of our practices. And that's another thing is I'm embracing digital. You know, all my stuff is online. I got a web form my clients fill out my contract. Is E signed? Because, you know, for, I'm, I'm eligible to practice anywhere in the state. I don't focus up north. I don't, I don't want to go out of the state. But I mean, if I do, I could get admitted. And, and I have a couple cases now in Texas and Tennessee that I'm, you know, admitted to practice on on those limited basis. But for the most part, if, you know, if you get in a rec in Louisiana and you're, you're from New Orleans and you move away, I still can represent you. And so that's another point is you got to pivot to be able to say, hey, I'm not making this person drive down six hours, nor as willing as I am to go make a house call. Let's time. You know, time equals money. I'm not going to drive six and a half hours there and back. So waste a whole day just to sign up a client when I could do it online. We could hop on, you know, we could hop on a zoom and if we need to do face to face thing but for the most part it's here, here's what I do, here's how I do it. I could coordinate your treatment from back here. I could do anything. And sure enough, I got the client, we settled the claim and now that guy's referring me client. You know, it's great. And that's awesome as a PlayStation. Yeah.
[00:37:28] Speaker B: So that's, that's awesome. Another way to get clients right there, people. But yeah, agility, you're small, you can do those things. Lean into it. I'll, you know, outperform the, the other guys that have been around. Maybe not the big guys but the, the mid size are the ones that used to be performing and now they're not. So things to take advantage of, things to get ahead, things to win. So. Well, Tommy, I appreciate you coming on the show and sharing your unique background and your story. Some of the things that you're doing. Hopefully people can learn from what's the best way for, for folks to connect with you or reach out.
[00:37:59] Speaker A: So probably the best way is our website because I only say that because it has all the information we need go on the website. It's either bottle law.com or better call botto.com. we have two phone lines that you could call or text if you're to the New Orleans area. 504-323-7777. If you're outlying it's 985-303-7777. And I'm also, you know, very responsive to email. So you could email me at any time. I do get a lot of engagement on social media but like I tell everybody, look, we could, we could start the process there. You could DM me, you could message my office page and it kind of goes back to the whole beginning of this conversation. I'll flesh out your issue. If you're saying, hey, like my, one of my big thing is oh, I got a legal question. Well, doesn't everybody tell me what your legal question is in regards to and I could get there. But yeah, you reach out to me in social media, we'll start the process there. Once I know it's something I could help you out with. Will touch base whether phone or email or something like that. But yeah, I mean I'm easily accessible. All social media, Facebook, Instagram are the two big ones. But I'm on X. Twitter as well. Yeah, you. You have to. It's. And you know, you have the greatest computer you need in the palm of your hand, and all your stuff is here. So your life, you know, paralegals and cell phones are a lawyer's lifeline. So embrace it now. Cause it's not going anywhere.
[00:39:09] Speaker B: That's right. Good, Good tip. Well, Tommy, I appreciate it. Stay on with me, everyone. Thank you so much for tuning in. Go out there, get it done. If you're in a small market, law firm owner, you can get it done. You can. You know, if you're for a big market, a competitive market, I'm watching folks be successful. So just find out what makes you different and how you can be different than the big firms and. And leverage that. And you'd be surprised. So get after it, and we'll see you all soon. Thanks for tuning in.
[00:39:32] Speaker A: Appreciate it. Thanks, Sam.
