Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: So many times, something that I'm acutely aware of is that when people call me or need me, it's like they're many times in the worst part of.
[00:00:07] Speaker B: Their life, the first time they've had to call a lawyer.
[00:00:09] Speaker A: I always think of every case, like, every lawyer is going to tell you, like, well, I see every case as if it's going to trial. Like, so many lawyers don't do trials. But I, you know, I've done 74 trials, which is a lot.
But it's. So it's to understand not just what happens at the early end of the process. Hey, you're, you're involved like you were run over by a truck or like a, someone crashes into your. What's short term? Like, what are the next things that can happen? But then it's also like long term, what are the insurance companies going to do to try to fight you and beat you on your claims? And how are jurors going to react to that? What, what are, what are good arguments for them? What are bad arguments for them? And how do you, like, try to navigate all that around? If you're calling a lawyer, like, hey, I just got, you know, super injured by something, and if I'm going through like an AI process to be able to intake a case or give information, like, how does that make you feel? Do you trust it? Do you not trust?
[00:00:52] Speaker B: I just kind of think like, so I haven't had to call a lawyer in that kind of situation. If I was to call like my doctor or a dentist or a, you know, even a chiropractor where I'm trying to get like a pretty personal service that I'm kind of like, I need to feel good about showing up. I want a person and I want them to be trained and handle the situation properly. I think AI is nice in some cases. It's consistent. It's not having a bad day and it's not going to, you know, have an attitude on the phone. So I think there's a place for it. But I think, you know, if you really want to do things right, I think at the moment, right now, I would stay away from straight AI intake and not talking to a person.
I think there's a time and place for it. And so I think in the, in the injury space, I would, I wouldn't like it. And I'm, I'm talking to lots of people right now because we do marketing and intake's so important.
Most firms survive the best ones scale.
Welcome to the Managing Partners podcast, where law firm Leaders learn to think bigger.
I'm Kevin. Daisy.
Let's jump in.
What's up, everyone? Kevin Deasy here.
Second day of law de Gras here in San Diego. Having a good time. Met this gentleman checking out our minutes ago.
[00:02:00] Speaker A: I was looking at the liquid IVs, and I was like, what's going on over here?
[00:02:04] Speaker B: Yeah. Pro tip. Put some liquid IVs and some energy drinks on your table.
[00:02:07] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:02:08] Speaker B: And you'll get all the. The attention. So, Eric, welcome. Thanks for joining me today.
[00:02:12] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. I'm looking forward to checking out your podcast more and love what you're doing. It's fun.
[00:02:17] Speaker B: Appreciate it. The podcast, you know, been on a mission just to help lawyers run their businesses better.
[00:02:22] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:02:22] Speaker B: And all the content centered around all those little subjects, so culture, sales intake, leadership, you know, the things that we all struggle with. So excited to learn more about your firms and tell us about your. Based in San Diego.
[00:02:37] Speaker A: Yeah, based in San Diego. I grew up in Chicagoland, but I haven't lived in San Diego for 20 years. So my firm is Antonian Miranda. They built the business doing family law, so divorce, custody issues.
They brought me on to do. To lead and do their personal injury cases. So I've been doing that for a handful of months. But I've been doing PI before that. Before that, I was doing exclusively DUI defense cases and running my own firm.
[00:03:01] Speaker B: Okay.
[00:03:02] Speaker A: So, you know, it's a nice thing as, you know, like, the business of law can touch so many different parts of, you know, people's personal lives with what we go through.
[00:03:10] Speaker B: So, yeah, I think that's.
As a.
Someone that supports the industry versus being a lawyer myself and talking to so many lawyers, you know, a lot of people actually go, kevin, you're a lawyer, right? And I'm like, no.
[00:03:25] Speaker B: I got my associate's degree in engineering and didn't even take that to the next step. So I was an entrepreneur really young at 23, and so I just fell in love with that.
But, yeah, lawyers and law firms say they help so many people in all areas of their lives, and so just been a great thing to be a part of.
[00:03:47] Speaker A: So.
[00:03:47] Speaker B: So you got an interesting background. You kind of come through a couple different channels.
[00:03:51] Speaker A: Yeah, lots of different things.
[00:03:52] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:03:52] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:03:53] Speaker B: What is your big focus with PI in California? Are you based, like, geographically? Are you the whole state or what are you focused on?
[00:04:00] Speaker A: It's all over. And really, it's all over the country. Like, I. Because when I was doing my. My criminal background, as I like to say, you know, my criminal History.
Just because I've tried so many cases.
It's really like, I'm based out of California and license in California, but I can be brought on to do cases and trials, like, all over the country. And I. If you've heard of it, the Trial Lawyers College, which is like a nationwide plaintiffs organization.
Organization for plaintiff lawyers, criminal defense lawyers, but, like, we just try cases. So it's about being all over the country and just really telling people stories. Like fighting big agencies, fighting governments, fighting.
[00:04:35] Speaker B: I told you I would.
[00:04:36] Speaker A: Big insurance companies, like that kind of a thing. So I live in California, but it's, like, up and down the state, but really it's across the country, and it's just about being connected with people. Kind of like what you're doing, like, connecting with people.
[00:04:48] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:04:48] Speaker A: Being able to tell people stories and just doing the best that we can, like, for people that are hurt or wronged in some way. Like, how do we help these people to the best that we can?
And many times that's. How do we, like, punch the other side in the face as hard as we can?
[00:05:02] Speaker B: Yeah. That's awesome, man. Yeah, it's just, you know, a lot of things happening and, you know, a lot of lawyers stepping up for, you know, what's happening within laws and things like that. So it's not just them getting a case and taking it to the process and. And making the revenue off of this. They're literally standing up and fighting back and trying to make a change.
[00:05:22] Speaker A: Right.
[00:05:22] Speaker B: For what's happening.
[00:05:23] Speaker A: Right.
Yeah.
[00:05:24] Speaker B: So just, I think this perspective of general public to lawyers versus like an insider like myself, you know what I mean? That really sees what. What these law firms are doing.
[00:05:33] Speaker A: Yes. Yeah. Yeah. I'm interested to see just how, since you're connected with so many lawyers, like, how. How is it that. That you connect with just lawyers that at large as you're doing the podcast or just in general?
[00:05:44] Speaker B: I mean, you know, when I. When I. I've been doing marketing for. When I was 23, I started my own agency. Right. And so it wasn't only with lawyers, but I had some lawyers as clients.
[00:05:52] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:05:53] Speaker B: And at some point, I was like, I got a niche and focus and. And who's my best client? Who do I want to help? Who do I want to work with? And just narrowed that down to. To lawyers.
And a lot of people go, whoa, why? Yeah, why would she want to do that?
[00:06:05] Speaker A: You poor thing.
[00:06:06] Speaker B: And I'll joke, but it's. It's been like, the best decision I've ever made. And great people, great friends.
[00:06:13] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:06:14] Speaker B: You think stuffy in a suit, you know, hard ass kind of people. And it's just quite the opposite. They're. They're out there.
[00:06:21] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:06:21] Speaker B: You know, I know some of those folks.
[00:06:23] Speaker A: Oh, yeah? Yeah.
[00:06:24] Speaker B: But you know, check out Eric. We're sitting here in a cool vest and we're hanging out. I got flip flops on, you can't see them, but it's just such a cool vibe here.
[00:06:32] Speaker A: Oh yeah, yeah, it's a cool vibe here. The thing with lawyers is because I, I didn't grow up with lawyers in the family or like being around a bunch of lawyers. Like, thankfully, my family never had to like get a lawyer for either someone's arrested or someone was, you know, killed in a car crash or something like that. But you don't need a lawyer until you really, really need a lawyer.
[00:06:50] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:06:51] Speaker A: And so many times something that I'm acutely aware of is that when people call me or need me, it's like they're many times in the worst part.
[00:06:58] Speaker B: Of their life and the first time they've had to call a lawyer.
[00:07:01] Speaker A: Right. Yeah. So then. And I think a lot about that. It's.
And because I have, because I, because I've done so many trials, like, I just, I always think of every case. Like every lawyer is going to tell you, like, oh, I see every case as if it's going to trial. Like, so many lawyers don't do trials. But I, you know, I've done 74 trials, which is a lot.
But it's so it's to understand not just what happens at the early end of the process. Like, hey, you're, you're like you were run over by a truck or like a, someone crashes into you or whatever.
[00:07:27] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:07:27] Speaker A: Like, what's short term, like, what are the next things that can happen? But then it's also like long term, like, what are the insurance companies going to do to try to fight you and beat you on your claims? And how are jurors going to react to that? And what, what are, what are good arguments for them? What are bad arguments for them? And how do you like, try to navigate all that around?
[00:07:45] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:07:46] Speaker A: You know, and it's so, and if I can give someone credible information at the beginning, just like, you know, part of it's walking them through the process and educating you. Like, hey, this is like the questions that you should be asking are this. But then here's like, how the process works. Here's how they're going to try to screw you. Here's how we can approach that and try to, like, counterbalance that.
[00:08:05] Speaker B: And you have to do this fresh, new. Every time.
[00:08:08] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:08:08] Speaker B: It's their first time. Yeah, every time. So you have to be on your. Your game and, and remember that, hey, they don't know. Yeah. What's going to happen or what's going on here? So I have to take them through the whole process.
[00:08:21] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Because it's a lot. It's, it's. It's daunting and it's scary and there's pitfalls in it. And then it's also me being a lawyer, like, if I get into a case where, you know, you know, I have learned a lot of stuff, but there's so much that I don't know. So then if I get into a case, it's like, I need to try to, like, call a friend to, like, do a case with them.
[00:08:41] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:08:41] Speaker A: You know, not to have any shame with that, because we're just. We just want to do the best that we can with the clients we have.
And so much of that is just knowledge. Like, if you have the knowledge, like, it's, it's just like. It's a game of chess, but it's a game of chess where you're, like, getting punched in the face and you're punching other people in the face.
[00:08:55] Speaker B: Well, it's a game of chess, but you bring in your best pieces.
[00:08:58] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:08:58] Speaker B: So if it's another lawyer.
[00:09:00] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:09:00] Speaker B: Or a referral partner.
[00:09:01] Speaker A: Yeah. Like, I got 10 queens.
[00:09:03] Speaker B: Yeah. And you're going to do. And that's the best firms I know that they refer stuff out without question when they know it's something that they're not the best at.
[00:09:11] Speaker A: Right.
[00:09:12] Speaker B: And that means the client's getting the best service.
[00:09:14] Speaker A: Yeah. So, yeah, absolutely.
So it's, you know, it's. It's a good business.
It can be an honorable business. It can be a very dishonorable business, which is a shame. And that's our colleagues, and that's something to be aware of. And it's, you know, you. You the consumer, or if someone calls, like, you know, all I can do is just be honest with people. And especially, you know, this conference is so neat because there's so much AI that's happening, you know, at such a quick, quick clip. So then it's like, well, how do you.
Well, let me ask you. So if you're calling a lawyer, like, hey, I just got, you know, super injured by something, and if I'm going through, like, an AI process to be Able to intake a case or give information. Like, how does that make you feel? Do you trust it? Do you not trust it?
[00:09:58] Speaker B: No, I just kind of think like, so if I haven't had to call a lawyer in that kind of situation, if I was to call like my doctor or a dentist or even a chiropractor, where I'm trying to get like a pretty personal service that I'm kind of like, I need to feel good about showing up.
[00:10:15] Speaker B: I want a person and I want them to be trained and handle the situation properly.
I think AI is nice in some cases. It's consistent. It's not having a bad day and it's not gonna, you know, have an attitude on the phone. So I think there's a place for it.
But I think, you know, if you really want to do things right, I think at the moment, right now, would stay away from straight AI intake and not talking to a person.
I think there's a time and place for it.
And so I think in the, in the injury space, I would.
I wouldn't like it. And I'm. I'm talking to lots of people right now because we do it. Marketing and intake's so important.
[00:10:54] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:10:55] Speaker B: And so if you're not going to answer the phone because you can't and AI is the only best choice.
Yeah. You know, do it, give it a shot. But it's. You need to invest in your intake team.
[00:11:05] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:11:05] Speaker B: In my opinion, it's.
[00:11:07] Speaker A: Yeah, it's such a balance because then it's. You have your intake team and then you. Or you could outsource it. But do you trust. Do you know the people that you're working with? Do you trust them? Have you trained them?
[00:11:18] Speaker B: Yeah, because it's a lot to it and like an outsourced ones are not great. So, I mean, yeah, there's some good ones out there, but I mean, there's. You're still getting mixed bags.
[00:11:27] Speaker A: Yeah. But then the complete flip side of it is that if a lawyer doesn't have the time to talk because they're busy in quarter. Busy in trials, which there's so many great trial lawyers that are here. And like, you know, Bob Simon, who's running this thing, like, he's in trial all the time and his team is in trials all the time.
[00:11:42] Speaker A: They can't talk to you right now because they're in trial. And because they're doing that, they're just gathering all this information so that when they talk to you, it's going to be good shit that they're talking to you about.
[00:11:50] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:11:51] Speaker A: But then me, the consumer, I'm like, well, I just want to talk to somebody.
But, man, it is such a catch 22.
[00:11:57] Speaker B: It is. And it's so fast paced now. And so much money.
[00:12:00] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:12:00] Speaker B: And you call one lawyer, two minutes later they hired someone else. So it's, it's. It's a hard game out there. But intake's so important. We talk about that on the podcast.
[00:12:07] Speaker A: Oh, yeah, but, but Eric, man, it's been a pleasure.
[00:12:10] Speaker B: Nice meeting you. Thanks for coming on the show.
[00:12:12] Speaker A: Thanks for having me.
[00:12:12] Speaker B: If you're not at Law de Graw, better book your ticket next year. They always do a.
A discounted ticket, like, the day after this is over, so.
[00:12:21] Speaker A: Yeah. Fantastic. Well, hey, man, thanks for having me on your show. And I just.
You all out there can't see, like, the setup that they have, but Gary's running. Running sound and like, video over there. Like, this is a really good setup that you all have over here.
[00:12:31] Speaker B: So. Yeah.
[00:12:33] Speaker A: Pleasure, dude. All right, cool.
[00:12:35] Speaker B: We'll see you all next time.
